Jun 03 2008
Does Beauty Hurt/Harm?
me: I was thinking about it
and beauty does hurt
kaz: how so
me: virtue
patience
modesty
kaz: how do those hurt
me: Because this is beauty that can only be encaptured by the heart. The majority of people can see with their eyes, hear wih their ears and smell with their noses. But Allah swt only hand-picks a few of His slaves to envision and perceive through their hearts.
\kaz: beauty is in everyone
anyone can perceive and envision it
this is what surah rahman commands us to do
to recognize and appreciate and internalize His favors
me: which includes hardship and pain
kaz: but ultimately
you come to appreciate the beauty
and realize
you were only harming yourself all along
me: love is given to us by Allah
you agree?
kaz: of course
me: does it not hurt?
are there not trails to faith?
kaz: of course love hurts
but there is beauty in that hurt
me: is love not beauty?
kaz: that causes you to reflect
and ultimately embrace it as it is
the true believer is never grieved
me: no
kaz: because they know the instant they are tested with hardship
they are gaining reward for it
and it is a sign of God’s love
me: the best fiath is one that has been doubted
kaz: that they are being tested
me: questioned
and succeeds dispite it all
there is a reason why we can’t “see” Allah
in the shallowist of senses
kaz: sure
for me I have the greatest ownership of my faith
me: beauty hurts
kaz: and I felt I finally “converted”
me: my point is made
kaz: when I learned to question it
to no end
I don’t see how that says
“beauty hurts”
at all
because perhaps beauty does hurt
but it does not harm
because from that hurt comes remembrance of Him and a cleansed heart
hence
more beauty
beauty begets beauty
and God is a lover of that
me: but in a perverse heart beauty may harm. may that’s why some are always in hell. anyways to deny that beauty doesn’t hurt is to deny a key step in a process in beauty degeting beauty
and beauty can harm
beauty of women is a prime example
kaz: a step… exactly
but not the outcome
me: we’re on the net are we not?
sometimes an outcome
sometimes not
kaz: then that’s the heart’s fault for not recognizing
anyway
you’re making a case
not against my words
but the words of the Prophet
so I will go with the assumption that his contention is ultimately true
and I enjoy finding all the ways
of putting meaning behind his words
me: it is the fault of the heartthat why i am assuming there is hell
umm? i suggest you quote the hadith then
with Arabic for the purpose of this discussion
and haqq saying I am making a case against the Prophet(s) sounds awfully pretentious
self rightious much?
kaz: uh
all I’m saying
is that I directly quoted the prophet
and you’re directly saying it’s incorrect…
no pretentiousness homie
the way I work
I accept the truth of his words
and then use my own reflection and inquisition to attach my own meaning to them
and discussing this with you
has been an excellent way of doing that
me: one sec
sorry I am a little busy
me: ok kaz
send me the hadith
with the soucre and all
or as much as you know
and I’ll get back to thee
inshAllah
kaz: ok…
I’m not really interested in getting into a debate over the validity of the hadith
here it is in full
me: not validity
perhaps
but meaning
arabic is a maze
read what you want into it…
“Women are not created weaker but more generous than men. They’re created more beautiful and less fierce, as beauty hates to hurt and harm others. That’s why they seem weak to people, but they’re not. Angels are the strongest created beings, and women are closer to the angelic nature than men, as they’re readier than men to carry angelic light. It’s the good manners and ethics of spirituality which they carry that makes them less forceful than men.They undergo great upheavals in their body without flinching for the sake of childbirth, and face the direst physical conditions more successfully than men because God has enabled them to ensure the survival of generations.”
~ prophet (later I found out that: [quoted from a friend] ” as for the relevant statement, like i knew it isnt really a hadith, and actually now that i read the whole post, i recognize exactly where it came from. this is all only a part of the Isra/Mi’raj literature quoted by Shaykh Nazim Haqqani of the Naqshbandi Sufi Tariqa, and this section quoted is a part of his speech which he gave a long time ago about that, which was later written down and published online
however a disclaimer:
the “mistake” is on the one who read these words of Shaykh Nazim, and assumed he was quoting a hadith, and then when he came to copying it said, “this is a hadith from the Prophet’s own description of what he saw in the Mi’raj”, and Shaykh Nazim never meant it to be taken as a hadith as such.
rather, Shaykh Nazim was speaking of his own vision and knowledge that he gained about some of the things the Prophet (alayhi salat wa salam) went thru during the Mi’raj; therefore, since Shaykh Nazim didnt attribute these words to the Prophet, then whoever wrote you in the conversation you posted shouldnt quote that as his words (alayhi salat wa salam), but realize that this is all from Kashf (spiritual vision) of Shaykh Nazim Haqqani.”) on with the conversation
me: umm perhaps then it would be best to say each side can be part of the reaction to beauty
but the thing is beauty is not an emotion…it can inspire them–but it isn’t a feeling–whereas love is..so love does have a counterpoint, whether that’s pain or hatred, etc.
kaz: yeah I’d abide to that
Assalmaualykum sis
There is much truth in the saying beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and as you say beauty can hurt, if one perceives him/herself (or even someone else) to be beautiful then they judge others by that standard, and those who don’t meet that standard inevitably end up being hurt.
If you think Allah is the most beautiful of us all, yet those who choose not to believe choose to compare Him azza wajal to their own notions of God, and that is where they are hurting themselves.
Beauty is in each individual, and its not just a face value thing, Allah is beautiful and He has indeed put beauty everywhere, in everything and everyone, yet it takes those with true love for Allah to see that and not judge others by preconceived notions of beauty.
Allah (swt) is beautiful and He loves beauty, this shows that beauty does inspire love, yet remember true love is the one for the sake of Allah, and if it does end up hurting you there is good in that, on the flip side, beauty also inspires lust, and thats where you get all the pain and no gain :)
I hope that makes sense.
Ma’assalam
Ps: Could you source the hadith for me please, it was beautiful. X
beauty
am I beautiful?
interesting…
Women are not created weaker but more generous than men. They’re created more beautiful and less fierce, as beauty hates to hurt and harm others. That’s why they seem weak to people, but they’re not. Angels are the strongest created beings, and women are closer to the angelic nature than men, as they’re readier than men to carry angelic light. It’s the good manners and ethics of spirituality which they carry that makes them less forceful than men.They undergo great upheavals in their body without flinching for the sake of childbirth, and face the direst physical conditions more successfully than men because God has enabled them to ensure the survival of generations.
That’s going on my facebook.
Seriously Ilana this brought me to tears.
great post
or conversation
ilana i have to say tho, it would be so great to see more “personal” writing from you, since after reading alot of what you’ve written, and mostly posted convos, it seems like its too general and abstract, all the while you’re putting a cover or screen over your inner self and trying to hide something…. which is palpable
especially this post for example… there is something you are hiding i think (could be wrong). in any case, its your prerogative to hide or to reveal
by the way, altho the ‘hadith’ quoted is beautiful and eloquent, i have high doubts that it came from the Prophet’s mouth (alayhi salat wa salam), and the main reason for that is that this isnt his style of speaking. he was alayhi salat wa salam economical in speech, and never drew out his words like that. so the meaning of that paragraph he would have stated in a small sentence. so the style and syntax is not his, this come from a much later period. in any case, there is nothing wrong with the actual content of the words in sha’Allah.